hey sebastien, there is kind of a mistake here because according to dzongsar khyentse CPN is a anuyoga practice, not kriya
Hi Han, well you can add that information to the CPN page, and also add a footnote to this article. But I don't think we can say Jetsün Kushok Chimey Luding is making a 'mistake'; maybe she is talking about Tara sadhanas in general, not about the specific view of the CPN sadhana.--Sébastien (talk) 19:12, 22 September 2015 (CEST)
Hello all - Just as a matter of interest – there are at least three levels of sadhana practice – outer, inner, and secret. If you were to take as an example the Green Tara practice revealed by the gterma revealer Mchog 'gyur gling pa which is part of the Zab tig grol ma gterma cycle. The cycle contains three distinct levels of sadhana: outer inner and secret. The outer sadhana consists basically of an upa/charya style four mandala offering practice (which is the Zabtik Drolchok practice that we do here at Lerab Ling)so the conduct is basically the same as kriyayoga hence the emphasis on abstaining from meat and alcohol, etc.; the inner contains a mahayoga level coarse and subtle generation stage, and the secret is an anuyoga level completion stage. - Tsondru
well perhaps mistake was an unfortunate word choice, but perhaps we could clarify a bit here, exactly what tsondru is saying here. According to Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche, the practice belongs to the category of Kriya Tantra, but with the view of Anuttarayoga Tantra. as it says about the zabtik, perhaps CPN is like that also: According to Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche, the practice belongs to the category of Kriya Tantra, but with the view of Anuttarayoga Tantra.also there is this commentary by palden sherab explantion the 21 taras according to anu and ati yoga as well. i'll think about it - han
hi , as OTR said: the Chimé Phakmé Nyingtik belongs to the Kyepa Mahayoga, (http://all-otr.org/vajrayana/3-how-to-do-a-chime-phakme-nyingtik-retreat) perhaps we should qualify this here by saying 'all tara practices (in the sakya tradition)' or, saying 'most tara practices'
Hi Han, So 1) DJK and OTR don't agree about CPN then! 2) Jetsün Kushok Chimey Luding doesn't say she's speaking only about sadhanas in the Sakya tradition... I guess this categorisation of sadhanas is highly subjective.--Sébastien (talk) 09:39, 16 October 2015 (CEST)
hi seb, okey, we have not come to the end of this, and it requires a bit more research, but that does not mean that it is a 'subjective matter'. you see CPN in a deity in union, and that can only really happen in the inner tantra's. there is no outer tantra with deities in union.